No easy answers in wake of shootings, just lots of questions
PORTLAND, Ore. - In the wake of a mass shooting at a school in Connecticut, and a deadly shooting at the Clackamas Town Center here in Oregon, there are lots of questions being raised.
Are our schools safe? Does our nation have a problem with guns? Should the government do something? How can we protect our kids?
They are issues we have been looking at for a week now - ever since a young man walked into the Clackamas Town Center with an AR-15 rifle and then a few days later a gunman went on a killing spree at an elementary school in Connecticut.
It is difficult to make sense of these types of crimes. On Wednesday, we explored some of the topics that have been on people's minds since last week - how this is impacting our children, what schools are doing to keep students safe and whether it's time to put measures in place in response to gun violence in our nation.
What Local Teens are Thinking
We stopped by Beaverton High School to listen in on a classroom discussion about last week's events. Everything was on the table - topics like school security and mental illness. But, like the rest of the country, the gun issue is what got students talking the most. KATU's Lincoln Graves reports:
What Parents Should Know About School Safety
So many parents immediately thought of their own kids' safety when reports of the school shooting in Connecticut first started pouring in. Plus, in just the last week there have been several school threats in our area.
To help get some answers to some of your questions about school safety, we asked Sgt. Tim Sessions with the Portland Police Bureau's Youth Services Division to stop by our studio for a couple of roundtable discussions (you can watch them below). He has some great insight and advice for concerned parents:
Roundtable #1
Roundtable #2
The Gun Debate
Now of course, the issue of gun violence in our nation has taken center stage in the past week. It's a topic that has been under discussion for years, but in the wake of the deadly school shootings in both Oregon and Connecticut it has become even more heated.
Wednesday morning, President Barack Obama asked a team led by Vice President Joe Biden to come up with a concrete plan by January to reduce gun violence in the United States.
Among the president's goals: close the so-called "gun show loophole" across the country that allows people in some states to buy guns from private dealers without a background check.
That loophole doesn't exist at gun stores, however, where buyers already must pass a background check. So in Oregon and Washington, what exactly does that background check entail and what cause would the state have to deny someone a weapon? KATU Reporter Dan Tilkin takes a look:
The president's announcement underscores the urgency the White House sees in formulating a response to the Newtown shooting. The massacre has prompted several congressional gun rights supporters to consider new legislation to control firearms, and there is some concern that their willingness to engage could fade as the shock and sorrow over the Newtown shooting eases.
Obama said it was "encouraging" to see people of different backgrounds and political affiliations coming to an understanding that the country has an obligation to prevent such violence.
Appealing to gun owners, Obama said he believes in the Second Amendment and the country's strong tradition of gun ownership. And he said "the vast majority of gun owners in America are responsible."
Here locally, Oregon Gov. John Kitzhaber has asked his staff to bring forward a range of options to improve school security, expand access to mental health and address firearms regulations. It is all but certain that gun control will be on the table when the state Legislature convenes Jan. 10.
Healing at the Clackamas Town Center
Shoppers are back at the Clackamas Town Center and retailers are getting business again.
It's been a week since 22-year-old Jacob Roberts made his way through the mall with an AR-15 rifle and a hockey mask on his face. He shot and killed two people, seriously wounded a teenage girl and then took his own life.
Those who were there that day will never forget what happened, especially those who have jobs at the mall and have had to work through their emotions so they can get back to making a living.
Mall employees are getting support in a lot of ways, however, which is helping. KATU Reporter Anna Canzano shows us how shoppers and the community at large are pulling together:
On Wednesday, a small group got together at the mall to sing carols to try to lift everyone's holiday spirits. KATU Photojournalist Bob Foster captured the magic:
These mass shootings mostly done by young men who have no life outside of violent video games, movies and television. Until the media starts changing what it calls news and entertainment, no change will happen. Where do you think these evil creeps get their ideas?Â
Â
Â
This comment has been deleted
 @HarryJuku LOL! The vote.
30 people murdered every day by drunk drivers in this country - nobody gives a damn.
Â
I say if we ban guns, we need to be banning alcohol again too.
"ever since a young man walked into the Clackamas Town Center with an AR-15 rifle and then a few days later a gunman went on a killing spree at an elementary school in Connecticut"
Â
Really? That's what happened? We wouldn't want to be ambiguous and have people think it's because of the mall shooting in San Diego on Sunday that you, KATU, didn't report. But thanks for filling us all in.
Â
This comment has been deleted
 @HarryJuku You know who was unable to do anything about anything? The adults at the school. The philosophy of harsh language followed by sucking your thumb and hoping to God he runs out of ammo before he gets to you went out of vogue in 1945.
Â
Â
 @HarryJuku No, I'm not saying that at all. See, now you have to put words in my mouth just to win your argument.
 @Playanekes I read about that...don't remember where, bad gun owner but he didn't shoot anyone.
This comment has been deleted
 @HarryJuku Why do you need a car?
 @HarryJuku ""Why does a civilian need an AR15?""
Â
Because of people like you, Harry. Because your ideological leaders--the ones that are telling us they're going to ban assault weapons--are the ones who happen to have been caught selling the same weapons to Mexican drug cartels.
Â
Because the US government is one of the largest arms dealers in the world, and as such it shouldn't be dictating to its law-abiding citizens what they can and can't own.
Â
Besides. I don't need an AR-15 if I have an AK-47, and I can rip 10-round clips through a semi-automatic SKS quicker than I can swap 30-round magazines in the same rifle.
Â
One question Harry refuses to answer at all is, if you ban the guns, how are you going to go and take them?
This comment has been deleted
 @HarryJukuEnough of you, troll.
@Playanekes  I'll see your AR-15 and AK, and raise you an M1A1....
 @Derek2mk Are you talking about the .308, or the tank. I'd trade mine for either, actually.
Â
I have a friend who's an officer of an M1A1 platoon out of Fort Hood. He used to be a civil war reenactor. (Confederate.) It's weird thinking of his as "a good kid." Except for a friend in Seattle, everybody I know who drove armor of any type owns an AR-15 or three. Two of them are NRA instructors. So if you have an M1A1, come on over, friend. You're on our team! We got beer, we got NASCAR, we got football, we got cheerleaders singing the National Anthem. We fired the male cheerleaders. BBQ, venison, turkey. We got video games if you're too drunk to shoot. Thermite, napalm, guns, knives, tactical nukes, pointy sticks, we got Kid Rock. ...Fireworks EVERY night, and none of that hippie foo-foo civilian stuff. P-51 Mustangs, jeeps, stickers with crying eagles on 'em.
Â
Jimmy's got weed behind the shed, but don't tell anyone, and he'll kick your ass if he sees you playing with a gun. Might see Sarah back there. There's some Vietnam veterans but nobody can find them. Mostly they only come out at night, mostly.
@HarryJuku   Why does anyone need anything? A person doesn't have to justify owning an AR-15. The 2nd Amendment isn't conditional on need. The courts have addressed this point. I own one because I wanted one. I don't have to explain it to anyone.
This comment has been deleted
 @neveragain There have been people in these forums advocating mandatory mental health screenings, mandatory IQ exams and, of course, a total repeal of the 2nd Amendment.  They simply don't have any idea and I bet none of them has ever even -heard- of Tule Lake. Imagine the ultra-liberal scenario where there are no guns. Then, imagine a screwball election in which there is a terrorist attack, and Administration X decides its time to round up all the Muslims, or homosexuals, or environmentalists, or anarchists, or journalists... you know, just for awhile. Factually speaking, they did it to Japanese-Americans in World War II and there were no terror attacks.
 @HarryJuku  @neveragainÂ
Â
"Oh My god rolling on the floor laughing my a-- off laughing out lout out loud out loud!!!"    If you never needed evidence that we need better mental health care, there it is. Somebody call Nurse Rached.
@HarryJuku  "Wether you like it or not."  Pot, meet kettle.Â
Â
you wont need your guns just get on the train. you just have to go to a camp for ahwile. when that happens to you i hope you laugh just as hard dumb ass
prayed for romney is more like. instead because of liberal idiots the very ideas that built america are being threatened. if you choose to be a victim when the obama knocks on your door and you need a gun. simply trust me( said every mass murdering comunist ever) thats your choice. but you start with one gun next it will be all guns. you wanna be that victim thats great but you are in serious need of an education if you think less guns means safer america
@HarryJuku    And if you think you and your statist buddies can tear up the Contitution, you are in for a pretty big surprise.
Our schools are not safe as long as we continue to leave the unprotected. Even just one or two are people- or better yet recently retired vets. Who better to protect our children then the men who volunteer to protect everything else about our way of life? our nation does not have a gun problem. If anything, we need more safe sane citizens need to be armed. Criminals will always find ways around any law you make. Thatâs why they are criminals. The problem is the crazies. And the liberal media that high lights them as them as these immortalized evil men like itâs a good thing. Even if I try I canât remember a photo of a victim from the theater shooting in CO, Just the crazy bastard who did it because all they posted about. Thatâs a HUGE Problem. if then government wants to do something they need to put more research and help into mental illness assistance. Taking guns away and making them harder to obtain for law abiding citizens. Doesnât really work, didnât work for Russia, Germany, china, Uganda, Cuba and many many others. Armed we are citizens, unarmed... we are subjects. I pray for America right. The idea of trying to take away one of our principle rights as Americans, by a president with an obvious hidden agenda. This is all coming from someone who has worked in a dangerous menatlly challeneged enviroment and been the first responder to an active shooter situation. I donât know how anyone is sleeping right now
This comment has been deleted
 @neveragain The media has been immortalizing evil people since it's existed...John Wayne Gasey, Ted Bundy, all of them, it's nothing new.
Â
So, we don't have a gun problem and one of the answers is to add more guns. I find it all to be self fulfilling. 2nd amendment says everyone can have guns, a lot of people buy guns, they get stolen and used in crimes, people become afraid and by more guns, and so on, etc...etc....you have to admit it hasn't worked very well.
Stock up on weapons, ammo and magazines. The US is suspending habeas corpus. They can some and take you away at anytime and toss you in prison. No trial, no charges, no attorney and no communication with anyone.
Â
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/12/18/ndaa-indefinite-detention_n_2326225.html
Â
This comment has been deleted
@HarryJuku Just for you I just ordered 2K rds of 5.56, and in the ship to name, I used Harry Juku! I only have to pick it up at the local kiosk facility and have to sign your pathetic onscreen name to it.............LOL
 @HarryJuku  @flyroy @PlayanekesÂ
Harry, reality check here.
Â
In order for anything to do with guns to make it into law, the House and Senate have to pass the laws. Since the House is controlled but Republicans and there are few southern Democrats that will vote for more gun control it is unlike that anything will pass in the near future.
Â
Even if it does, it will be meaningless as was the first assault weapons ban. The only real issue was the magazines that exceeded 10 rounds. But companies got around that with rebuild kits for existing magazines.
Â
There are 300,000,000 guns in the US and billions of rounds of ammo. Citizens in the US own more guns than the total military of all the worlds armies including reserve and paramilitary. If one were to consider the honest law abiding citizens as a backup to the military we would have a standing army of over 100 million people.
Â
I have enough guns and ammo to supply my whole neighborhood.
Â
You seem to forget the second amendment and the Oregon constitution that allow citizens to carry weapons for self defense.
Â
If your kind decided to actually try and take guns away you would have to do several things.
- get someone who doesn't believe that citizens have the right to bare arms to take them away. Most police and military believe in the right to bare arms.
- get someone who doesn't want to live because few will give up guns voluntarily.
- be prepared for a civil war with the gun owners winning every battle since those that don't believe in guns won't have any.
Â
You are setting yourself up for a big disappointment. Already guns, ammo and high capacity magazines are out of stock as there has been a run on those items like the world has never seen. Companies are working day and night to meet the demand.
Â
Â
 @HarryJuku  @flyroy You get right on that, Janet.
 @HarryJuku  @RalphCramden Right! Like my friend said when we bought our AK-47 ammo at Hanks in Forest Grove. "I always pay for ammo with cash."We'll be sure to register those rifle serial numbers. Nobody's gonna enforce your ban, there, Janet Reno. They didn't last time, which is how I acquired a rifle with a folding stock, detachable hi-cap magazine and bayonet while the liberals were high-fiving each other for the Clinton assault weapons ban. $250 will still buy you the weapon that kicked America out of Vietnam, there, Janet and if you limit magazine size, we'll just have to refurbish the old magazines. You can't outlaw springs.
Â
Â
 @Playanekes  @HarryJukuÂ
Everyone runs out eventually. But they may be standing in a pile of hot brass...8-}
 @HarryJuku  @RalphCramden Believe me, sweet cheeks, I'm not going to ever run out of ammo.
Are our schools safe?
Â
Reasonably so, yes. In my experience, there is a good deal of control designed into the public schools insofar as restricting access and/or monitoring non-educational staff. About the only improvement I could suggest would be mandating an ARMED law enforcement officer on campuses. Of course, the immediate problem is funding for that officer. Second to that is the innaine idea that a trained law enforcement officer should be required to be unarmed while on school property.Â
Â
Â
Does our nation have a problem with guns?
Â
Strawman question. Our nation has a bevy of 'problems' in widely varying degrees. There are problems within the 2nd ammendment applications, on that I can agree. The problem (as is typically the case) is in how we go about guaranteeing the right of citizens to own firearms, while maintaining some type of control over the use of them. Laws are unlikely to do that, as demonstrated by so many different mass shootings where laws were being broken by the assailants. The problem is not the guns, it's the people using them and how they choose to use them. Your headline is 100% accurate in that respect, there are no easy answers. Which is exactly what the majority of proposed gun laws are striving for, easy answers... proverbial security blankets. Proposals that will give the appearance of creating saftey, but really do not. It's a dysfunction of our society whereby people equate doing anything with doing something.
Â
Should the government do something?Â
Â
Like what?
Â
The question assumes two things that simply make me shudder;
Â
1) That we (as a society) should be dependent upon 'the government' for our personal saftey, or as models for behavior and/or moral guidance.Â
Â
2) That legislation (read:laws) do anything. Ask yourself this... If we were to pass legislation tomorrow that made all magazines holding more than 10 rounds, any gun that has a recoil spring (read:automatic), and any weapon over .38 caliber illegal, do you sincerely believe that a criminal would no longer be able to get a hold of them? Laws do NOTHING. Want a perfect example, do some research on restraining/no contact orders.Â
Â
Â
How can we protect our kids?
Â
I (please note, not 'we', but 'I') protect my children first and foremost by providing them an appropriately structured place in which to grow and learn moral, ethical behavior. I also protect them by teaching them both self defense, and the mindset in which to use it. In addition, I've taught them that a gun is just a tool. Not unlike a chainsaw or a car. It is a tool, that if misused or operated improperly, can (and will) cause irreperable harm or death upon the user and/or someone else. I teach them in EVERY circumstance to look for safe passage (egress) routes, and to be situationally aware at all times. Perhaps most importantly, I teach them that panic and conflict are the enemies of progress.Â
 @margay1 Succinct and well put! @MarkKpic
Banning assault rifles will be as effective as banning drugs and weed. Criminals don't follow the law. Besides, handguns fire at a quick enough rate that these shooters can just start bringing multiple handguns with them. Heaven forbid that they bring a bomb. The point that I'm trying to make is that people are going after the wrong thing. They should be focusing on the people rather than the tool. Do we ban vehicles because people get drunk and kill others?
@Chris Somethingoranother ....tell me, does the NRA send out fliers with the same 6th grade level arguments printed in them for all their members so spout out whenever confronted with opposing views?
Â
as effective as banning drugs?....dumb, tired, boring......ban cars?....dumb, tired, boring....criminals don't follow the law?...dumb, tired, boring.....focus on the people, not the tool?.....dumb, tired, boring.
Â
You gunophiles need to freshen up your lame a$$ arguments because they just don't pan out anymore.
Â
you WILL be losing your rights, and if someone has to remove your guns by force, then I guess we'll be getting out the pliers to "pry" them loose.
Â
Buh bye
 @Solipsist01 I think you need to look in the mirror for your old worn out arguments. For every other bad thing that happens in the US people blame something else besides the an inanimate objects involved around the incident.
Â
For some reason GUNS hold a special place in the liberal mind as something that can come to life and possess qualities only found in humans and living things.
@Solipsist01"you WILL be losing your rights, and if someone has to remove your guns by force, then I guess we'll be getting out the pliers to "pry" them loose.
Â
There it is, folks. The lines are being drawn. Knuckle-skull here says he's going to take on the NRA and AR-15s with pliers.  Come and get 'em, squirt.
 @HarryJuku " I wish I understood where all your rage and lust for guns really comes from."
Â
That's your problem, Janet Reno. Come and take them.
the boy in the first video was right.What does the gun control suppose to do? why would assault rifles ever be out there in the fist place when the only use for them is to kill lots of people.And guns don't kill people people do. do they really think with gun control that people will keep bad people from getting their hands on one because that cant get one in a legal way (like they would really care about that. There are places and time that people had guns.All gun control would do is keep good people from defending there-selfÂ
Why all the hoopla about "gun violence"?
Violence of ANY kind should be addressed.
And it should start from the top down.
But, why bother...we'll be our own destruction.
This comment has been deleted
 @HarryJuku  @Mikey You could kill a lot more people at the mall with some xxL and a roll of aluminum foil. Or some legal fireworks, roofing nails and a pop can.
Any of you fools ever eat at a buffet? A salad bar?Â
Â
How far do you want to argue this? Are you going to live in fear, and run around and try to legislate away crazy people, or are you going to stop ENABLING people who like to cause fear by reacting to them.
Â
We're not arguing over butter knives but wait until somebody brings out machete and you'll try to ban that too.
Why aren't my burning questions getting answered? What's all this talk about gun control and what have you? What I want to know is what kind of underwear the shooter was wearing and if he owned one of those Hopper things from Dish Network.
 @PDXguy23 You think he was a Bieber fan, or more of a J-Lo type. What's that other band?
Â
"All the other kids with their pumped up kick better run, better run, faster than my bullet..."Â -Foster the People
"you can have my gun when you pry it from my cold dead hands,"....I'm good with that too....either way, all you gun fetishists out there are going to be parting ways with your favorite aphrodisiacs real soon.
This comment has been deleted
 @HarryJuku  @Solipsist01 "Let them keep the guns and take away all the ammo."He's going to "let us" keep the guns, and simultaneously "take away" all the ammo. That's awesome. I can't wait to see that plan in action.
 @Solipsist01 So you really think our government is going to round up all the guns? Are you that dumb? Every police officer I know which is several owns multiple guns that can not be tracked to them just because of the concern about idiots like you. They know that no one will protect you better then you can protect yourself.
Â
Did you know that legally the police are not even required to show up to your house if you call and tell them someone is killing your wife and raping your daughter?
Â
There is nothing you can legally do if they don't show up or show up 45 minutes after the call.
Â
So the reality is the only sure way to always be able to protect yourself is to have the ability and equivalent force to protect yourself that the law officers have.
Â
Now granted most police are very good people who would risk their life to save your family but even if they come ASAP it is still going to take between 2 to 15 minutes for someone to get there.
 @Solipsist01 That's some pretty big chest-thumping there. How are you going to get them? Threats and harsh language? You gonna send in the troops like Janet Reno did?Â
Â
I remember all the criticisms about the arm-chair warriors hoo-rawing and sending other people's children off to do the actual fighting. It's weird how well that describes you right now.