Legal wranglings in Kyron Horman disappearance continue
PORTLAND, Ore. (AP) - The biological mother of a missing Oregon boy says her civil suit against the boy's stepmother should move forward, despite the stepmother's request for a two-year delay.
Desiree Young says Terri Horman should not be allowed to delay Young's suit by two years.
Horman asked for the delay last month, saying a criminal investigation should conclude before Young's suit goes forward.
Young is seeking $10 million, and wants to force Horman to lead her to her son, Kyron Horman.
Kyron was 7 when he went missing after a June 2010 science fair. Young says Horman knows where to find Kyron or his remains.
Young's attorney, Elden Rosenthal, said in a Thursday filing that there's no Oregon precedent for deciding whether to delay a civil case while a criminal one plays out and notes that Horman has not been indicted.
"The big picture here is this: Kyron Horman has been missing for 26 months," the filing asserts. "Despite a monumental investigative effort by the Multnomah County Sheriff's Office, Terri Horman has not been indicted.
"The trail is getting cold. A stay of these civil proceedings would work a hardship, inequity and injustice upon the plaintiff, the public and the court."
The civil lawsuit accuses Horman of kidnapping Kyron, by herself or with help.
Investigators have long focused on Horman, although they have not named her as a suspect or filed criminal charges. In Horman's motion, attorney Peter Bunch wrote that the civil suit seeks facts that could lead to a criminal prosecution.
In a reply brief filed Thursday, Rosenthal says there's no reason to hold off on the civil suit, and denies the case is a "stalking horse" for police to use to pry answers out of Horman.
Civil allegations require a lower standard of proof — a preponderance of evidence — than criminal charges, which must be proven beyond a reasonable doubt.
Horman's motion to delay the civil suit said that compelling her to testify could force her to invoke her constitutional right against self-incrimination, pointing out the weak spots in her case.
"She can defend herself," Young's brief asserts. "If she does not know what happened to Kyron, she can so testify."
Horman asked for and received a delay, or abatement, in her divorce from husband Kaine Horman, Kyron's father.
In Thursday's filing, Rosenthal said the delay in the divorce was granted only five months after Kyron went missing, when there was still a task force dedicated to finding him. The task force has since been put on hiatus.
"The situation is entirely different now," the filing states. It goes on to say that delays could be compromising to the search for Kyron.
Young "fears that the trail is now becoming cold," according to the filing. "Witnesses may die or disappear. Memories may fade. Records may be destroyed or lost. Foggy memories may harden into concrete false memories.
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Reach reporter Nigel Duara on Twitter at www.twitter.com/nigelduara
Copyright 2012 The Associated Press.
Does anyone know what is going on with the teenage son of Terri? Â I saw him mentioned on Facebook but cant find what they were talking about.... If you know a news site that has that story I would very much be interested in reading it.... Thanks
 @Tamra_Erhardt Some news about James a while ago at the start of Desiree's suit to squeeze the fe-male into talking.  Seems he had moved in with  gramps and granny LOGAN Moulton and his mom.  One Big Happy Family.  (note James middle name is Logan, looks like a "family" thing right out of Grass Valley, CA where gramps&gram lived and adopted Terri.)
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 Remember the Torry Hansen episode in Shelbyville KY with the Russian adopted boy and it was discovered there was a mystery boy also in the household?  Do you remember the reporters never could find name of his parents... but did learn he was called LOGAN.  Most of the Hansen gang moved back to Hayfork and Redding CA where they were from, 'cept if some commenters were right, granny Hansen had been born in Grass Valley, CA - small world.)  James was set to join military... then Desiree & Atty filed against Mz. GimmeTheMoney whose response was to attempt to delay case for 2 years, so that she could buy time for some purpose... could it be to get her kid into military training and shipped out?  Judge said no delay, so James was still to be questioned.  Maybe already deposed.  Terri's delay request caused people to get the idea maybe another hit-man search needed to shut up James from blabbing whatever he knows.  She wouldn't do thaaaat, now would she!!!  You gotta be kidding.  RUN JAMES RUN FAST, she's got powerful jaws and no conscience, and obviously some very PowerfulRichPals and some useful idiots to do her bidding because they want in with the powerpeople too.  Oh dear could any of this be true?  Who knows, who knows, could be round the bend.  Throw mama from the train.  If the truth is given, it's the safest way to go forward safety.  Otherwise, it's an overtheshoulder constant view of the world.  Why are reporters in OR so uninterested in these procedures? Oh, btw, Torry Hansen got wrists smacked for not attending one or more legal deals in Shelbyville(?), she said she had a baby girl and that had conflicted with the Legal Hearings.  No marriage noted, who knows.  What was THAT about?  Seems they are making her pay support for the little boy she abused by airmailing back to Russia alone.  These folks in northern CA and up through Washington have more fun than a barrel of monkeys it seems.  Not as much as Americans are going to have celebrating the resolution of lots of crimes against children. Â
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 @Tamra_Erhardt Hummm  just wonderin' WHY did James leave his dad's home where he had been living and  has half-bro or half-sister siblings since his dad is married...  was there pressure to get him out to make it safer for his dad and family?  Was somebody wanting to put him in the same cell (home) with gramps and granny Moulton and mom Horman?  Was somebody trying to shut him up?  Looks like the plan was to keep him in that Fort and then get him out to the military and then....   As with everything in this case, it gets worse and information gets more and more blocked.  Ah where are the Bob Woodwards, the Assanges? Â
Update 8/16/12 - It is being reported by other news media websites that the Judge has found in Desiree Youngs favor and that they have ruled that the the Civil Suit may move forward.
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Thank goodness....now maybe we can get down to getting some answers from Terry Horman; that is, if she will talk. Â I think she still has the right to plead the 5th to avoid self incrimination, but if she does this that would be her saying that she played a roll in Kyron's disappearance that would incriminate her if she discussed it, so it would almost be a confession of her involvement. Â Â
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Go Mamma Desiree!!
For those of you who want to help support Desiree with moving her civil suit, please sign this petition on Change.org. One of the factors the judge will be considering is PUBLIC INTEREST.
http://www.change.org/petitions/justice-for-kyron-homran?fb_source=message&utm_campaign=share_button_modal&utm_medium=facebook&utm_source=share_petition&utm_term=25652406
I know why T.H. wants a delay, she knows if this goes through, she knows she is finished.
At some point, I wouldnât be surprised if Terri decided to leave the country and disappear to get away from the whole situation. Â
Kyron has rights also. What happened to his rights? Someone took them away from him. If TH is responsible for his disappearance, she should be held accountable and the only way to find out if she is responsible, is to get her on a stand and testify. (although it wouldn't surprise me if she perjured herself)
The lawsuit was stupid to begin with. If there was enough evidence against her, charges would have been filed she would be in jail right now.
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All she needs to do is get on the stand and say "I have no idea where he is. I had no part in his disappearance." Then they would have to prove otherwise, and if they could do that, she would already be in jail.
Don't understand the delaying of the divorce....what was she going to gain from that?
 @Aquagirl For the same reason as stated in her motion to delay the civil suit: compelling her to testify could force her to invoke her constitutional right against self-incrimination, pointing out the weak spots in her case.
Does anyone know why Desiree didn't have custody of her kids?
 @Aquagirl I think Kaine got custody of Kyron when Desiree had to go to Canada for medical treatment and apparently, she never asked for custody after she came back to Oregon.
yes, Desiree DID try to get Kyron back. Kaine told her "that is not an option". Desi leaves for medical care and loses her son to Kaine. Kaine brings TMH into the family and she disapears Kyron...... Good job, Kaine!
Don't understand the delaying of the divorce....what was she going to gain from that?
IMHO Terri Horman is guilty of murder or some lesser charge.....Think about this, if you were the step mom you would do everything humanly possible to solve this case and bring Kyron home. She has done just the opposite, thus IMHO she is a major suspect......I would offer her a polygraph, truth serum, voice stress or any other modern means to determine if she had any involvement........If she did not pass these tests, I would resort to such things as lifting her fingernails or showing her how a high speed drill feels as it enters the body.......Yes I know this is extreme but we have a child missing for over a year and this B$%^^&h is playing games.
 @FreerideNOT I could waterboard you into admitting you took Kyron, as well as shooting McKinley and sinking the Lusitania. They probably wouldn't be true, but apparently you don't care about the truth.
 @ShallowEnder Procedure of waterboard use would give the subject a chance to answer under polygraph questioning, where is the kid, what did they do with the kid, what do they know about the abduction.  If poly showed no lie, they would not be waterboarded.  If poly showed lie, they would be given chance to spill the beans and if continue to refuse, they would be questioned with waterboard.  Team would observe and be ready to rush to location revealed by waterboarded subject.  Team would report via cells if kid found.  If not, a second waterboard test would be given again with Team standing by to search location revealed.  If more failures, the subject would not continue with waterboard questioning but would immediately be given a second poly test to discover repeat or new lies.  Subject would be held until next suspect polygraphed and if lies discovered, would be waterboarded... which may reveal guilt of first waterboarded subject.  There must be a method and procedures that save children's lives.  Many times the discovery of a child's location can save their lives or cause their deaths in a very short time.  Waterboarding must be done for a purpose and with an intelligent technique that produces truth.  Â
 @FreerideNOT Advocating torture is irresponsible. Whether you like it or not, Terri Horman has not been proving guilty and retains her rights. Americans have rights for good reasons.
What about KYRON's RIGHTS???? What is wrong with you?
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 @mikew  mikew, the song has already been written... with a bit of artistic license added by yours truly.  Call US IRRESPONSIBLE, call US unreliable Throw in undependable too Do OUR foolish alibis bore you Well, WE'RE not too clever, WE just adore you KYRON HORMAN,  Call US UNPREDICTABLE, tell US WE'RE IMPRACTICAL Rainbows, WE'RE INCLINED to PURSUE Call US irresponsible, yes, WE'RE unreliable But it's undeniably true WE'RE IRRESPONSIBLY mad for you, KYRON HORMAN, Call US irresponsible, yes, WE'RE unreliable But it's undeniably true WE'RE IRRESPONSIBLY mad for you, KYRON HORMAN!! Â
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Oh, btw, mikew, Mzerable Terri Horman is certainly PROVING guilty herself, no help needed. Â (read your comment) Â We are not fools. Â Just took a few determined good clever people. Â
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How about helping Mz Terri defend herself? Â What can you add? Â Here's some information that needs confirming that might protect her;
The named Terri was put in an orphanage or adoption agency as a newborn in Grass Valley, CA. Â How long was she in that Agency or was she transferred immediately to the adoptive parents? Â People reportedly said that she was told she came from an important family. Â Last name not available of course, which will be legally opened because of many organizations working for justice and rights for adoptees, if we can get Ron Paul in the Presidency... he is all for individual rights and Constitution.
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Terri's adoptive parents Mr&Mrs Moulton lived in Grass Valley at the time they adopted her. Â Actually Mrs. Carol Logan Moulton (Carol's maiden name Logan) was born in Grass Valley her very own self!! Really a small tight world upstate CA and lower OR. Used to be great shipbuilding businesses because of all the trees, now not much forestry cutting business. Â What business was Carol Logan's family in, lumber? What business was her husband Moulton's family in, lumber? Â Everybody used to know everybody else and still remembers. Â Too bad there are no investigative reporters around to uncover stuff for the LE, but maybe the LE did and have it in their 3-ring clamp binder notebooks on the Kyron case that was up to what, 68 binders quite a while ago?Â
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Here's the suspected Trail of the suspected buyers from Sauvie... down I-5 to complex, split to the woods. Â Billions in child porn ya know. Â Did you read the big article in ABC online news around a week ago regarding the uncovered biggest Pedophile ring in USA and international, but was not reported in most media, and followup dropped by news that broke it. Â Infants 19 days old being raped on videos, one toddler undressed and raped holding Miffi doll, you know Miffi, the little cartoon and doll with the X's for eyes. Â So cute. They tracked the Miffi toddler through stuff they saw in the video and rescued the toddler, and captured the pervert. Â Who knows what they did with him. Information limited on others except one guy who was a puppeteer for children's parties in Florida and participated in rapes and tortures etc. Â Other States had participants. Â
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Feel free to comment with all the information you gather that might save Terri. Â Don't hesitate with any other discoveries.
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Waterboarding will be an approved technique when we get Kyron back and capture alll the perverts involved. Â
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So what is law enforcement's answer to the USB stick allegedly found at a Walmart in Soringfield ? Perhaps they are holding back ? or maybe nothing was found after all ? It would be great to resolve this situation once and for all. How about LE going back to Sauvies Isl again ...and take the cadeaver dogs this time.
 @Mazda84 "How about LE going back to Sauvies Isl again ...and take the cadeaver dogs this time."
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They've gone back multiple times with and without cadaver dogs. Different times of the year. Different days. Different crews. I've lost track of how many times they've gone to Sauvie's Island.Â
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That doesn't mean he isn't there. That only means they can't find significant enough evidence to look farther. I'm not going to say that LE has exhausted their leads and resources but, without Terri's willingness to provide information, it seems their hands are tied. Even if the other stuff you mentioned had anything of significance, we wouldn't hear about it until a criminal trial.
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All I know is that Kyron needs to come home. This case (or these cases) need to end. Kyron's parents deserve the chance to move forward with their lives -- in whatever form that may take.
Don't believe everything you read on a comment forum. People have been making stuff about this case since day one, and when enough morons repeat it, somehow everyone thinks it must be true. Too many armchair detectives on KATU.
@badcat I totally agree...it's why I want links...I mean...maybe what they're saying is true...maybe not. I just want to read it myself :)
TH wants a 2 year delay ? Why ? what is mysteriously going to happen in two years that it has to wait ? If TH wasn't guilty of something, she wouldn't need the sleazy criminal atty nor would she have to go into hiding ...
 @Mazda84 Just a mention that TH's attorney and Young's attorney are equally rated lawyers who are actually colleagues. Make out of that what you will....
WHY DOES THIS LADY JUST HIDE IN HER PARENTS HOUSE NEVER SAYING A WORD AND TRYING TO DELAY EVERY TRIAL AND BLOCKING HER OWN SON FROM TESTIFYING?? IF THAT DOESN'T SHOW 100% GUILT I DONT KNOW WHAT DOES!!
 @JRE Some article, maybe Katu, not sure, mentioned her son has moved in with her and her parents, his grandparents.  Probably to keep him away from reporters.  He is supposedly entering the military.  Gee, after training and being shipped to battleground somewhere, it might take around 2 years... and he likely won't come back.  hummmmm.  What political powers are supporting, guiding, protecting this female???
Never talk to the police, especially if you're innocent. They can and WILL use everything you say against you, and it's easy to phrase something wrong when you're under duress. If she doesn't know anything and can't help, the smartest thing to do is shut up and stop saying anything. You see how anxious everyone is convict her with NO evidence -- why give them more ammunition? The cops are obviously inept and would love to pin this on Teri just to say they solved the case. If she can't help Kyron, at least protect her other son and herself from being wrongly interrogated and possibly incarcerated. Look what the Ramsays went through. You're not very smart, JRE.
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@badcat Absolutely! False confessions happen all to often, mostly due to highly unethical "interrogation tactics".
What I am curious about is the father - he lived with his new wife in the same house while suspecting that she is hiding some info about his son's disappearance. Given I am not a man, but I would choke this lady until she gives all info I need - it's your son's life in stake. Instead he just blew some air on TV. Is it he just such a wimp or he does not really think that she is hiding something from investigation.
 @Julie It is my understanding that they had members of law enforcement with them pretty much 24-7 so they wouldn't have had a chance to be alone together. It also sounds like LE was suspicious of both of them initially thus the reason for the 24-7 "care". As far as has been disclosed, no substantial information was gained from this observation period.
 @Julie From what I have heard, he was too involved in some other personal activities to be paying close enough attention to what might have been going on in his own home. That said, I'm not saying that I necessarily think Terri had anything to do with Kyron's disappearance.
I think the focus needs to be turned toward Kyron's REAL MOTHER; something does not seem right with her....
 @August100 I think she may feel guilty for having allowed Kaine to have custody of Kyron, even though she had some misgivings (warranted or not) about Terri.
 @August100 You are far from alone in your suspicions, August100. If Desiree hated Terri as much as she obviously does, why did she allow her to raise Kyron? Why didn't she and her cop husband try to regain custody of Kyron? Why did Desiree give up custody of BOTH her sons? Desiree has always been more interested in blaming Terri and ruining her life than she was in finding out what really happened to Kyron. She admitted she suspected Terri of harming Kyron the moment she heard he was missing, before she even heard any details. She and her husband I'm sure shared her suspicions with police. MCSO ruined the investigation into Kyron's disappearance from the getgo by focusing all their attentions on Terri and not considering other possibilities. They have absolutely no evidence Terri did anything to make Kyron disappear, she was never even named a suspect or POI.
 @QuandoQuandoQuandoOh lookks like there's another pro Terri Blinkster here
@QuandoQuandoQuando @August100 Where on earth do you get your information??? You need something to bring you down off that high you seem to be on.
@August100
Why ? what is off to you about her ?
The fake, tearless crying seems odd to me.
@badcat Fake?? And what would it take for it to become "real" to you? Why do you see her tears as "fake"? I have seen tears streaming down her face. Maybe you need glasses :)
 @August100 Seriously??  You must be Terry's friend or family member. Â
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@August100 Terry is the guilty one. There is nothing wrong with the real mother and she wasn't even around. They have there focus on the right person. They just need to work a little harder at getting the truth out of her.
@August100 Oh? And that might be???? And you think something is so right with TH? Just explain your comment. What do you percieve to be "not right" about his mother?
I wish this little boy could be found - one way or the other. It's so sad to think about him being missing for so long without any solid evidence as to what happened to him. Maybe, one day, the truth will be revealed and Kyron will come home.Â
If Terri has never been named a suspect and says she knows nothing, why is she concerned about a criminal suit? At the very least, if she is found to be withholding info with the civil suit and is held in contempt, she can be put in jail... which is where everyone knows she belongs. She should not be allowed to be living as a free person.
 @snuggles Your comment suggests vigilantism and a lack of understanding of basic American rights. Anger or distress are not good reasons to violate the rights of others as the same could easily happen to you. If Terri is guilty, the law enforcement community needs to do it the right way and prove it in criminal court.
They never found the guy on Sauvie Island who shot that cop after losing his gig at the fire department for alleged personal issues involving some red-haired woman. You will recall that his neighbor reported seeing TH's truck, her, and the kid in front of that guy's house before the guy became a fugitive for shooting a cop. Anybody know how that all turned out?
 @Dienekes4160 You are full of bovine manure. You're just repeating rumors you've heard.
@Dienekes4160 Is that why they searched Sauvie Island? I never heard in the news why they searched it.
 @Unknown4  @Dienekes4160 I thought they searched Sauvie Island because Terri's cell phone pinged in the area.
@Dienekes4160 No, but to add more information to this; someone found a usb stick at walmart in springfield that had pictures of kyron and other kids at some place that looked like sauvie's island on it...
@portlandborn83 Where are you guys getting this information??? Let us know so we can read it too...this really intrigues me now!
@Bewitchin1 They gave it to the police of course...
@portlandborn83  So...what? They turned it over to LE? Or did they "find" the stick and looked at it and just hung on to it???
@Bewitchin1 Someone I know found the usb stick and it thus has not been publicized or mentioned anywhere...
@Dienekes4160 Uhmmmm....it's been awhile now, but I don't remember that. Any links to where I could read about that?
@Bewitchin1
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http://blinkoncrime.com/2011/01/30/fugitive-cop-shooter-david-durhams-house-located-in-new-kyron-horman-search-grid/
@Acacia Wildwood Thanks Acacia...I'm very familiar with blinkoncrime :) But forgot about over the last few months. Going right there!
I don't remember this.....now I'm curious.