Facebook post helps police uncover murder-suicide

@Greg11 Another excuse to blame the gun. 

@Caspertoo @Yamhill354 Fact is, if he hadn't used a gun this loser would have found another way probably a knife.  Too bad this POS of a human being had to be such a chicken s**t!

 @JOJOJO  @Lips Lips isn't trying to be harsh or critical.  I know it seems that way.  I see the point as being valid -- depending on the circumstances, ages of the children involved, the degree of knowledge the neighbors had, etc.  I'm sure the situation would have been different if you'd had a teenager (especially an older one) than a child who happened to have been a playmate.

 

The way I see it -- you did what you had to do and what you thought was the most appropriate in that moment.  Some might later have regrets for their actions while others might feel just fine.  It is what it is and, sadly, you had to experience it.  For that I am very sorry.  You were put in a position that I doubt very many parents understand or recognize.  It wasn't fair to you or your family or the neighborhood to be left with the responsibility you didn't create.  I'm not even going to address the pain the close friends and families of all involved are suffering.

 

You and your neighbors will surely honor the friends you've lost in your own way.  I hope it helps bring your community closer together because that will be a powerful positive statement.

 

Don't forget if you need to reach out, that places like the Dougy Center can really offer support and advice for yourself and your family (as well as those in the neighborhood or who might have had friendships with the children).  Good luck to you and your family in getting through this tragedy.

 @Lips  I happen to be one of the Neighbors with one of the kids. Jackson use to come over and play with my kid all the time. We did not find out about the murders tell 7pm . Telling my son that he has to go cry in his room and throw away his fireworks would not be in his best interest. I cannot believe you would actually say that we should of punished our kids for a crazy persons actions. If I took away my kids fourth, he would of thought he was being punished. That would of caused anger toward Jackson and cause a bad memory of the child. My child is having a hard time with this so back off!!!

 @Dienekes4160  @Owt_Raged  @CTWU  @Lips Of course no one has suggested that a photo should be shown to the children. I know you're upset, but don't be so dramatic. If your family had just been killed would you find it distasteful for people around the scene to continue on as if it just didn't matter? Whether that was their intention or not? I don't think you would. I think you'd have a little more compassion for the loss of two precious babies that will never see another firework, ever. 

 @CTWU I believe my post said I would tell my kids the truth.  I would never pass information on to my children that was untrue.

At the age of 9 I saw a guy, drunk (That was explained to me later) flip his truck and decapitate himself.  It was gruesome.  I had to run to the only house with a phone in the area and call the police. (small town) My parents came to the scene, I recall we talked about it in bits and pieces for years.  I had nightmares one maybe two nights.  But my parents being open and honest took the fear out of the situation.

A statement like "Honey, the people in the house all got killed.  We don't know how, but it's sad that it happened.  Do you have any questions?"  Might be the place to start.

 @Owt_Raged  @Dienekes4160 You are assuming you had all of the information.  Speculating is completely different than knowing the truth. And that's when things can get scary.

 @Dienekes4160  @Owt_Raged  @CTWU  @Lips You can tell your kids the truth without scarring them.  If my neighbor had killed his entire family, I would have told my kids.  Not the gory details, but I would have told them they were killed and that the husband had done it before killing himself.  I would have answered my children's questions honestly, but on their level.

The guy obviously had problems, I would want my kids to know, and I would want them to ask questions.  How else will they learn to recognize situations that they should stay away from?

If a kid asked me, I would tell them.  I can't believe that with all that police activity, the kids didn't ask.  They are naturally curious, and will find out.  Telling them might keep them from seeking out the information elsewhere and coming across the photo you mentioned.

@Owt_Raged @CTWU @Lips We kept a photo that he sent us of his wife after he had murdered her in case the police need it, because we didn't know whether he had killed himself. Your kids do not need to know about this and if they found out, or saw the image, you'd wish to God they hadn't.

@CTWU

I am guessing you were told your grandfather died, and then were given the opportunity to go forward with Christmas (what kid wouldn't) or not.  But the situation would have been remembered differently by you, had your parents hid your grandfathers death until after the holidays.

I did not suggest that the neighbors mourn or throw away their kids fireworks.  I only suggested that being honest with the kids would have been better.

I can't imagine if I was the parent of the wife that was killed, knowing the neighbors knew and pretended that everything was just fine.

And it's not just kids.  As an adult, I lost both parents, within a few years of each other.  I "went through the motions" of life for over a year after their death, but I didn't hide the fact that they had died.  Not even from the grandchildren who were quite young.  We still remind our grandchildren about their great grandparents.

But I personally don't agree with ignoring the situation until it's more convenient.

 @Owt_Raged You teach your children that life goes on.  It isn't fake or shallow.  It is simply living.  Sometimes that is what we have to do to move forward.  I doubt the neighbors knew very much outside of the fact that police kept coming and going to the home.  My grandfather died a week before Christmas when I was a kid.  So you're saying we shouldn't have "celebrated" Christmas?  Looking back I can see that my parents were just going through the routine (probably partially in shock, no doubt) that they'd established a couple of years earlier when we were born.  It could even be the neighbors closest to the home and closest to the family may have either been in shock and only acted on impulse (thus continuing their celebration) or may have subdued their activities but that wasn't picked up by the media.

 

So, when my niece was diagnosed at 3 with a potential terminal cancer you know what the adults did?  We acted.  We went through the motion of living.  If any of us needed a minute to be angry, mad, sad, depressed or whatever, we never showed it in front of her.  We needed her to fight.  We needed her to believe that being 3, sitting in a hospital room with a ton of strangers doing who-knows-what to you was perfectly normal.  It was just a boring new day.  As she got older and better able to understand how serious her illness was, we revealed more and more adult truths to her.  She's now been cancer-free for many years and she's thanked us for supporting her.

 

Parents have to be in the right frame of mind to be able to support their kids.  The kids also have to be old enough to understand what they are being told.  I don't know the ages of the kids in the neighborhood or what the adults did tell them or when.  I also strongly feel that parents need to teach their children appropriate responses to both the tragedies and the triumphs in their lives so seeing their father cry or their mother yell is vital to growing up with a better mental health outlook.  If parents don't know how to tell their children or how to support them, they need to reach out to places like the Dougy Center.  The last thing you want to do is scare them further.

 @Dienekes4160  @Don_Keyshow  @Mai "Do the 200 or so friends of hers that are reading this a favor and find another forum to blather this stuff."

 

Sadly, that is what many of the people who post on forums do.  I tell people that are directly involved in pretty much any news story that they should avoid forums like these.  Some people like to hide behind the anonymity that these forums create while others seem to really enjoy causing additional pain.

 

So, please, to anyone reading these forums who is directly involved in this case, don't.  Find comfort with those you know truly care.  I'm sure some of you are more than a little fragile right now and you certainly don't want to say something that might jeopardize a criminal investigation (and you never know when you might say something that could).

 @AgedCrystal Very sorry that you're all going through this. It's such a horrific event, and it's much easier for me, looking in from the outside to pass judgement. I apologize. When I first learned of this, it seemed like so many people were trying to act like it wasn't happening. I'm sure everyone was in a state of shock, as well.

@AgedCrystal @Lips You did exactly the right thing. There's a time for young kids to learn about evil in their midst, and it's not the 4th of July. I hope you guys at able to get through it and move on. Amy didn't talk to her neighbors for help, most likely because she feared for their safety if he found out.

 @Lips Sorry if I gave the wrong impression of trying to shield the children, that is not what I personally was trying to do.  My son was a friend to both of the children that were killed as were alot of the others in the area.  Young children of 2-3 do not understand well at that age what it means to have a sick person kill someone else.  Believe me, once the details were confirmed the parents spoke with our children about what exactly had happened and why.  My son is no stranger to DV and knows what it is like. He knows that we could have been in the same situation at one time.  The children around here are very upset with the whole thing and are now mourning the loss of good friends.  The parents are mourning the loss of a neighbor.   No offense was meant to anyone.