Price on safety? Cuts would eliminate police in Portland schools
PORTLAND, Ore. – Portland police officers stationed in high schools are at risk of being removed from the campuses to save money.
Right now, 21 sworn officers are assigned to schools across the Portland area.
The proposal, Portland Police Chief Mike Reese's budget, came as a surprise to the officers and administrators Wednesday, especially so soon after the Connecticut shooting.
Meanwhile, school resource officers for Grant High School and Jefferson High School met with members of campus security to discuss what the officers just learned in training for an active-shooter situation.
What happened at Sandy Hook has law enforcement across the country re-evaluating the best practices for keeping schools and kids safe in a situation like that.
But there are a myriad of services an armed and uniformed school resources officer like Spencer Sheldon says he provides that are just as vital on a day-to-day basis.
He's concerned about his role being cut.
"I think it's a mistake," he said. "I think that we have the unique ability to interact with the community like no other officer."
He says his presence on campus is a deterrent to violent crime. He's able to spot the infiltration of gang activity onto campus and put a stop to it.
He believes the visual impact of his patrol car being out in front of Grant High School helps keep known gang members away and reduce their ability to recruit younger kids.
He also mitigates conflicts between children and removes guns when they're brought to school.
Grant was already stretched in terms of security. Cuts last year from the district reduced its four campus monitors down to two. Those two campus monitors are not armed. And that's for a student population of 1,600.
In addition to Portland Public Schools, the officers also serve Parkrose and David Douglas. They're assigned to high schools and operate out of them, but they also make the rounds at other elementary and middle schools in their coverage area.
In total, cutting them would save $2.1 million.
The bureau says it has its reasons for including these 21 officers on its list of cuts.
The bureau says with the 10-percent budget reduction it was asked to make, the chief had to target services like this that could be accomplished by everyday patrol officers.
So taking resource officers out of schools means beat cops working patrol would respond to calls on campus.
The schools used to pay for these officers but that changed in 2001.
Other proposed public safety cuts include the elimination of the police's property crimes investigation program and its 26 sworn officers; eliminating the mounted patrol unit and its seven sworn officers, and reducing the gang enforcement team by 10 officers.
The fire bureau proposes eliminating seven fire companies or closing seven fire stations and discontinuing its dive service.
Yeah, cut police presence. That seems like a smart decision...NOT!.... Just watch within the next few years as kids start shooting up schools.Â
What Charlie should be doing is finding bigger cuts in other places that aren't public safety oriented rather than cutting a police force that already can't get a handle on crime in this city.
This is how they get the public to give them more money. "We are going to have to take the protection of the children"...I guess we better find a new tax on the people to fund police in schools. It's funny that everyone always goes after the funds that are sure to pull at the heart strings.
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@Dr. Rawdog @Portlander29 Yes. Okay? Point being? So why aren't we talking about cutting 2.1 cops?
Isn't this a repeat of your post from 4 hours ago; feeling ignored ?
@Dr. Rawdog @Portlander29 Sorry I obviously have to be more clear. There are 21 cops on the unit (10% of that is 2.1...does anyone in this discussion do math?). Hales is being lazy and rather than figuring which bureaus should cut more and which should cut less, he just asks everyone to do 10%. So why isn't the police bureau just cutting 10% across the board rather than picking and choosing where to make the cuts. I mean, it works for the lazy mayor, why not for his underlings? Answer, say you are cutting something that protects kids...The media picks up on it like a fly on S*** and next time the government requests more tax dollars, it is the for more tax folks rallying cry. If you don't see the obvious pattern in government/taxation you are just not looking.
I find it horrendous that there has to be any discussion about armed officers to protect kids at schools....thanks 2nd amendment.
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 @Dr. Rawdog You do understand that my comment is not about .....oh never mind, I'll bring hand puppets next time.
I have a personal problem posting replies, but this one is big enough:
My first post:
Eliminate the mounted patrol. They are so ineffective at crowd control with groups like occupy portland.
My reply to an argument that I didn't see:Â
I forgot to hit the sarcasm button at the end of my post. Mounted cops are extremely intimidating doing crowd control. Intimidation to disperse is much nicer than tear gas IMHO.
10% across the board? Surely the mayor is able to make qualitative judgements. It's insane to say arts programs are as important as public safety. It's insane. You could start by totally eliminating Sam Adams hundred million dollar program of painting the streets green for bicycle lanes. They don't even last. They have to be repainted every 3 years!!!!
Interesting. There seems to be plenty of money for libraries, trail enhancements, arts parks, fountains, stormwater planters, bicycle lanes, bridges, green boxes no one understands, rebuilding every curb corner, etc.
It's really sad that we even have to consider having police in schools. It wasnt that long ago that the thought of armed guards or police in schools wasn't even imagined. Times have changed, and not for the better.
 @Bill Preston Well, I can tell you that my grandfather, as well as John Bunnell (COPS) and Bob Skipper, among others, used to patrol Centennial, Gresham, Corbett, Reynolds and David Douglas High Schools back during the late '60 and early '70s. Then the budget was cut and those deputies were assigned to do other things. History repeatin'.
This looks like it is being driven by the police chief and budget driven.
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Now we will see if the teachers union protests against these cuts which would make them hypocrites when they said they didn't want guns in schools.
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The antigunners may think this is a good idea because secretly they are hoping for another crisis they can capitalize on. To them the end justifies the means and a few sacrificial lambs is acceptable. Throughout history this has been a common event. In fact during several revolutions some factions have been known to kill some of their own to rally others to their cause. Of course they deny this but if one is astute enough they can see that they grab every political advantage they can right after a shooting.
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"You never let a serious crisis go to waste. And what I mean by that it's an opportunity to do things you think you could not do before." - Rahm Emanuel
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WIth the cops gone the Portland public school system can continue to deteriorate. It is one of the worst school systems in the nation for the size of the city when it comes to graduation. The blacks drop out in huge numbers and only 47% graduate. Many of those folks go on to be gang members. This will more than likely increase without cops who do a great job if working with these at risk kids.
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But the bottom line is that teachers want guns out of schools. As they say, there shouldn't be guns in schools.
 @RalphCramden "The antigunners may think this is a good idea because secretly they are hoping for another crisis they can capitalize on."
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Come on Ralph, that's disgusting and you know it, nobody wants another school shooting, anti or pro, that's a ridiculous statement.
 @deejm2112Â
That statement is based on historical fact and human psychology.
 @RalphCramden Just tell them blacks we are all the same color on the inside...
 @RalphCramden The antigunners may think this is a good idea because secretly they are hoping for another crisis they can capitalize on.
So my sons teacher is thinking it's a good idea he and others are killed by gun fire??
Really ralph is that your grasp on reality??
The fact you mention some may die for the good of all, was a war thing where nuclear bombs were used NOT my sons school OK.
Just sayin...
 @uknow2Â
I never said that your teacher is part of it. You read too much into my post which is a common mistake.
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Throughout history innocent people have been killed to further agenda's. Stalin and Hitler were very big on that and assassinated some of his own people and blamed it on the other side to get folks to come together to support him.
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The end justifies the means is a very dangerous belief that can dehumanize people into nothing but pawns in the desire for power.
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Just today a former Westboro Baptist Member stated that they would pray for people to be killed so they could protest their funerals. There are antigunners who think the same way. Lunatic fanatics think like that and relish the idea of anything they can do to further their agenda.
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You may not like it but it is reality.
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 @my2centsÂ
I have never said I was smart, smarter than anyone else, or said my answer was the right one. You just assume that I am all the above. If you looked at my previous personal description in IntenseDebate I described myself as no one of any importance.
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Your perception is your perception and I have nothing to do with that. My guess is that your perception is based on the fact that I have a stand with very little ambiguity and defend my position with logic, common sense and facts.
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As for life experience I have more than most as I have done a lot of different things. I am also constantly learning and reading journals and technical manuals. Currently I am finishing up my last degree (I am too old to start another).
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Many on the left feel threatened when someone who opposes their agenda gives them a run of their money when engaged in a discourse and run out of counter arguments. Then of course I get called a racist and other names which is what the left does when they can't come up with a reasonable counter argument.
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As for guns in the schools many teachers have said no guns should be allowed in schools. In fact they want gun free zones so that only criminals can have guns in schools.
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Finally  I know a lot of teachers who would carry a gun to defend the students. You just live in a world of liberals who are vocal on the issue and the conservative teachers just keep their mouth shut out of concerns that they will he shouted down or alienated by the liberal teachers. So in that respect you don't speak for all teachers, just the liberal group you associate with.
 @Sundowner  @my2centsÂ
You pretty much got it right.
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Forcing government to spend as much as possible to drive them into bankruptcy is a worthy goal. Then we can restart and get back to basics.
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Government is out of control and is too big, too powerful, and is infringing on our freedom on a daily basis. The sooner they go away the better.
 @my2cents You'll get used to Ralph (and ignore?).  He doesn't like anyone but him getting any kind of government assistance and belittles them for it, and yet his stated goal is to get as much as humanly possible out of the government in order for the economy of the US to completely implode.  Am I right Ralph?  I wouldn't want to misquote you.  And yes, I can quote you if you like.
 @RalphCramden Well Ralph if that is a common mistake with your posts perhaps it is your
writing that isn't clear. I find you arrogant with so much bravado on how much more life experience you say you have and much smarter you are above everyone else. You only see your side and back it up with situations you find on line that make your point the right only one. Â
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You are deliberately misstating teachers. The issue was if teachers should carry guys. Teachers don't want to CARRY guns. Their reason for being there is to education their students. That doesn't mean they oppose guns being carried by appropriate personnel that are there to protect their students.
when you really think about it, it makes perfect sense. With the illegals being given benefits of regular average joe's they will soon become voting citizens too btw, the tax payer dollars must be cut somewhere and allocated elsewhere... unless you want to pay more taxes for the cops at the school and benefits for illegals?
How about removing the police officer guarding the bank downtown and move him to a school?
@portlandborn83 Â Let's take a few from the state capitol and let them protect something worth protecting.
 @STEELHEAD  @portlandborn83 Charles Hales thinks the semiautomatic pistols his security guys carry aren't meant for anything but committing mass murder, so let's relieve him of those people and reassign them.
 @Playanekes Such malarkey, and yet so typical.  Just because (the majority of) people want to see an end to the status quo as it relates to the current rash of gun violence doesn't mean they think "semiautomatic pistols....aren't meant for anything but committing mass murder".  Nice effort, but try again.
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@Dr. Rawdog Maybe they should park old cop cars out front? Surely gang members aren't intelligent enough to know they are being duped?
"Portland police officers stationed in high schools are at risk of being removed from the campuses to save money."
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This is good. Teachers don't like guns in schools.
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 @Dr. RawdogÂ
Then this is a good move and should be encouraged by "most sane people".
 @RalphCramden  @UselessOpinion The coach who used his gun to protect two girls back east, the school employee at Pearl River, MS who used a gun to stop a shooting, and the security guard who stopped the shooter in Atlanta are most recent examples of hippie pacifist liberal overpaid trash employing guys with guns to do their work for them.
 @UselessOpinionÂ
For sure. We read about it almost daily.
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The last one I read about was.....well.....it was about.....ummmmm.......I'm guessing about.....well I can't think of any right now.
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Agreed. It is staggering how many trained police officers shoot up schools.
$2.1 Million for 21 officers? So where is all that money going? Maybe thats the portion that should be looked at. Certainly the officers don't a million a year.
@axpman  Math: 2.1 million/ 21= 100,000 with a large chuck of that amount going for health insurance, work comp, liability, equipment/uniforms, etc (it's a total cost, not just salary).Â
 @motherhawk Actually all of those come from different budgets. The 2.1M is for salaries alone.
@axpman @motherhawk Why doesn't the article say it will save 2.1M in salary for the 21 officers rather than just saying 2.1 million in savings then? Tough to believe you know hwat you are talking about when you thought 2.1 Mill was enough to pay 21 officers a million a year each? Did you think ti was just salary when you had it calculated out to 1M a year each? Really?
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Yep. Good to see you too, fre....I realized I had to leave there when I found I got dumber after reading reader posts.Â
Yeah, V... err, I mean sundowner ;) I figured I would find you guys here. Once the list of 'twits' grew to surpass the number of fingers in my possession, I knew it was time to go. Although I don't always agree with your views, there was always a certain respect and a noticable lack of namecalling....and you make me laugh. I will have an eye on you as well :) Â
 @UselessOpinion @Dr. Rawdog I'm just glad you didn't change your name or I'd never have figured it out.  Master____ wore me out (that translates to "bored me to tears") and it was time for me to take a hike...not permanently, just now and then.  I have some very strong and serious views, never hid them or tried to soften them up, but I really prefer to have a little fun in the middle of it all -- they were about as much fun as my sister-in-law (and that translates to zob, the new SamAdams, blah, blah).  Anyway, I'll keep an eye out on you!  =)) Â
 @my2cents  @Bill Preston Fishbait?
@Sundowner Thanks! Got waaaay too childish/trollish (over there). Much better convo format over here as well.
 @Bill Preston It is interesting that you just started posting with this new persona this month. You want to stir up questions here with the picture you posted, whoever it is. Your comments are that of a much older person.
 @UselessOpinion Hey there, useless!  Nice to see you here!
@UselessOpinion  lol, I would add, "I hate being bi-polar...it's awesome!"
There's three types of people in the world. Those who can count, and those who can't.
Simple. Put a public safety tax on guns.
 @motherhawk Put a safety tax on female cosmetic products and watch what happens.Â
@motherhawk   Why pick on just one tool of safety...... make sure you tax pepper spray, tazers, handcuffs, batons as these tools are more likelyto be used.
@kramr If all those items are taxed, I would imagine my Craigslist Dominatrix, will be forced to raise her "fee".   Thats painful from a personal finance situation.