'Your Voice, Your Vote:' Gun control in Oregon and Nike's tax bill

other country's will still have 50 round magazines and your saying them knowing that we don't have them we will not be attacked more then we already have been? i feel like or president is say to his people is i don't  trust any of the citizen of the u.s.a that you all are not smart enough to protect  your self. this will become another civil war! we still have solders off in other county's fight right now as you read this! are they taking them away from them too? and if they take ours now from the citizen why not take them from or solders too! i'm just saying where dose it stop? 

Typical narrow-minded, selfish liberal trash.  They aren't happy unless their energies are devoted to making other peoples' lives harder.

Here is an idea.  Lets just suppose for a minute that this is a free country and we all have rights that many people in other countries don't have and we all would like to keep them.....and not have ANYONE take them away because of THEIR stupid beliefs.......

 

It seems to me that few or none of these, "Incidences" have been perpetrated with a legally obtained firearm.  For the most part, the firearms used in these have been obtained illegally, through one means or another.  Herein lies the problem.  It logically follows that if you take away all firearms, the availability of such is going to be lessened.  This is an idiotic mentality.  It fails to deal with the problem. The problem is the people, not the method or tool used.

 

If you really want to affect change, you have to deal with this from this point of view. Not the current stupid points of view.  I suggest something along the lines of death penalty or life in federal prison for illegally obtaining a firearm. That may be excessive, but my point is, if you want to tighten gun control, you have to control the people that get them illegally.  They are the ones committing the crimes.  Stricter penalties would possibly give someone pause when considering stealing or illegally obtaining a firearm.

 

 

This forum reads like a fire fight of sorts, and the bloggers are writing novels on their opinions.  I am a simple woman that had the great priledge to grow the daughter of a once United States Marine. My father was one of the most responsible gun owners I hav ever know. I have never know him to shoot anyone, and doubt he has ever pointed a weapon at any citizen, and to hear him tell it, that's the point of his gun ownership. As for me I have stared down the barrel of a handgun more than once and the the thought of socialist police state scare me far more.  To me it's understandable why Law makers driving up the hill in Washinton D.C. in their bullet proof limos want gun conrol, but at the State level to restrict our freedoms makes no sense at all. Owning guns with honor and responsability is the only correct answer, to my way of thinking.

What we do not need is stupid politicians taking away our rights and freedoms to have weapons capable of protecting ourselves, our families, and our property. By gun control advocates reasonings the police would not need these weapons. Get real and get off my constitional freedoms and rights. You nor anyone else in favor of gun control will ever get my vote.

"You don't need 50 rd clips (magazines)." Do people need Escalades, a home in the city and a home in the country, a closet full of shoes, a computer, smart phone and a iPad. This is still a free country, so, Ginny, keep your government off my freedom.

Seung-Hui Cho used 10 round magazines to murder 32 people at Virginia Tech.  How 'bout that Ginny, you dipstick.

Here are some quotes from the Late, Great Charlton Heston:

 

SPEECH TO NATIONAL PRESS CLUB September 14, 1997

"...You do not define the First Amendment. It defines you. And it is bigger than you. That's how freedom works. It also demands you do your homework. Again and again, I hear gun owners say, how can we believe anything the anti-gun media says when they can't even get the facts right? For too long, you have swallowed manufactured statistics and fabricated technical support from anti-gun organizations that wouldn't know a semi- auto from a sharp stick. And it shows. You fall for it every time... ...I simply cannot stand by and watch a right guaranteed by the Constitution of the United States come under attack from those who either can't understand it, don't like the sound of it, or find themselves too philosophically squeamish to see why it remains the first among equals: Because it is the right we turn to when all else fails. That's why the Second Amendment is America's first freedom... ...Now, I doubt any of you would prefer a rolled up newspaper as a weapon against a dictator or a criminal intruder. Yet in essence, that is what you have asked our loved ones to do, through an ill-contrived and totally naive campaign against the Second Amendment..."

 

FOX News Channel September 15, 1997

"...There's no such thing as a good gun. There's no such thing as a bad gun. A gun in the hands of a bad man is a very dangerous thing. A gun in the hands of a good person is no danger to anyone except the bad guys... ...You could say that the paparazzi and the tabloids are sort of the `assault weapons' of the First Amendment. They're ugly, a lot of people don't like them, but they're protected by the First Amendment -- just as `assault weapons' are protected by the Second Amendment..."

 

NBC "Meet the Press" May 18, 1997

"...Let me make a short, opening, blanket comment. There are no good guns. There are no bad guns. Any gun in the hands of a bad man is a bad thing. Any gun in the hands of a decent person is no threat to anybody -- except bad people... ...Teddy Roosevelt hunted in the last century with a semiautomatic rifle. Most deer rifles are semiautomatic ... it's become a demonized phrase. The media distorts that and the public ill understands it... ...You know, the Bill of Rights guarantees every citizen the right to own and bear firearms. It doesn't say anything about how many, how much you can pay for them. That's in the Bill of Rights. That's a sacred document in our country. There's no other country in the world that has such document. And you know what it's purpose is? To prevent the federal government from interfering with private citizens' rights ... If you will read what the Founding Fathers wrote when they were writing it -- Jefferson, Mason, Madison, Patrick Henry, Tom Paine -- every one of them wrote at great length that they were talking about the individual rights of individual citizens... ...We have to pass on to America in the 21st century the same Bill of Rights that those wise, old, dead white guys that invented this country passed on to us..."

 

 

How come we never hear about how well Austrailia's gun control is working out? Now 1 year old and crime rates are up! Homocides up 3.2%, assults up 8.6%, armed robberies up 44%.  Look through History. this is comom place.          HTTP://www.dailypaul.com/75609/a-little-gun-history-lesson

Ginny Burdick is yet another voice in the long line of Leftist sycophants who want to curtail our civil liberties and replace our Constitutional Republic with a Socialist Police State.  We don't need more Nanny Statist politicians telling us what is good for us.  The real need is to address the issue, not the tool. I squarely lay the blame on the culture of Political Correctness (derived from Marxism).  Do the research, connect the dots, and formulate your own opinions, and quit toeing the party line of guns being the bad thing here.  The stupid is strong with the left, and they cannot cogently articulate an argument without debasing and vilifying those that are in disagreement.

Ginny, do everyone a favor and retire!!  Why don't you create a bill that makes gun safes tax deductible.  Why are you trying to infringe on my rights given the decisions of Jacob Roberts and Adam Lanza.  Both of these idiots stole these from their owners!!  I am a responsible gun owner and your decision to do this is short-sighted.  Go grandstand somewhere else!!   

"Its starting point is that any plan to "ban" or remove guns is a fantasy, given the hundreds of millions of them already in circulation. I agree. Prohibition didn't work with alcohol, it isn't working with drugs, and it wouldn't work with guns." - James Fallows, The Atlantic Monthly Magazine.

Freedom1267 and None. Your comments give me hope that all in not lost!

Last time this topic came up (shooting in Arizona I think) one of the statistics that was quoted was legal concealed gun permit holders commit .03% of TOTAL felonies which is to say almost none. Law abiding citizens who go to the trouble of legally carrying and getting training to safely, effectively use their weapon are the people you WANT to be carrying during shooting rampages.

 

How do you prevent what happened in Newtown other than security to get into every school and locked school buildings/classrooms that outsiders cannot enter. This isn't realistic so I'm not sure how things can be made more secure.

 

Bottom line is bad guys will get weapons regardless of regulations. And if it's not guns then it will be swords or knives like we have seen in China. People are the problem not the weapon they choose to use. Stopping people from going on rampages is the solution but I have no idea how this could be accomplished.

When our society allows the systematic removal of good, all that is left is evil. The forced removal of God and religious teachings from our society leaves only room for evil to grow and prosper.

 

Why in our society is everything that was once thought of as good and righteous now bad, while it seems that all that what was bad is now good?

Why does our nation display drug users, alcoholics, criminals and the perverted as roll models?

Why are there court actions to force the removal of nativity scenes and religious symbols from public and private lands?

Why do our courts release the criminals back into society?

 

Remember, the greatest lie ever told was the Devil convincing the world that he doesn't exist!

 

time for a little humor this monday morning.....  

 

 Chris Rock on gun control  (NSFW) remember this is humor, not a serious idea  :) 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzGRQF_sETY

Gun control isn't the answer to these problems. Even if guns are banned, or severely limited, guns aren't just going to magically disappear. It's fine if you want to discuss gun control, but don't just limit the conversation to that, all sides of the problem should be discussed. Our mental health programs in this country are severely lacking, and more attention should be given to this problem as a whole. Our government dolls out billions of dollars every year on social welfare programs, which is fine to a point, but there are millions of people who are capable of caring for themselves and are taking advantage of the system. These parasites need to weeded off of the government teet, and a majority of these programs need to be ended, and that money should be funneled into mental health, helping the people who truly need it. But as long as our political parties keep handing out welfare for votes and ignore the real problems nothing will change even if guns are banned. Also our media is partly to blame. They sensationalize the evil people who commit these crimes, plastering their face all over the news for days. Then they create a ranking system as to which shooting was deadlier. All this does is create a benchmark for the next guy. They need to spend more time reporting on the victims, make them the ones who people remember, not the perpetrators. If we quit making these monsters famous maybe that would deter some of them from committing these acts. Just simply banning guns without a full discussion of the problem as a whole, is a knee jerk reaction and a childish solution to an adult problem. 

Just a little perspective for the gun control crowd..........

 

The worst killing at a school was in 1927 where  there were 38 children dead at the school, two teachers and four other adults.

AND NOT ONE GUN WAS FIRED, THATS RIGHT NOT A SINGLE SHOT.

 

The weapon of choice was Dynomite

 

so the gun control crowd who thinks banning guns will fix things  are just wrong........

The only reason Jacob Roberts did not kill more people is because of an armed citizen. I would much rather have armed citizens to combat these criminals (yes criminals because that is what Jacob Roberts became when he started shooting people) because our police force is not required to protect us anymore. Even if they were a crime happens in seconds and the police can only get to you so fast. The only people that abide by laws are law abiding citizens NOT criminals! Criminals have all sorts of means to obtain weapons illegally. Why should we shame these lives that were lost and fight over guns when that isn't the real problem here. There are many other things that cause alot more deaths than guns such as tobacco and car accidents. We have become so desensitized to tobacco and car deaths that  it doesn't mean as much, yet the shock of the violence of guns is so rare to us that we need to ban anythign that has to do with it? That doesn't make any sense. Tobacco and cars claim lives of all ages AND although the federal government finds drugs illegal, how many of you do pot. What makes you think just because guns are banned people will stop committing gun related crimes? We all know that if you outlaw something, people are more apt to do it. Think people I challenge you!  There are more people that use guns properly than those that abuse them. Don't punish the many for a few. One day you may be thankful for a gun owning citizen (if you are ever in such an unfortunte situation where one is needed for protection). How do we help our children? Consider hardening our schools like Israel and other countries so that those who have no value on human life can't get to our children. Its not only about our children its about our society and the generations that come after. Let us protect ourselves so that no one dares threaten our lives again. I will not be at the mercy of a criminal. I will not be a victem. Will you?

When Bush let the assault weapons ban sunset in 2004, the carnage spiked, no self respecting hunter with ethics supports these offensive murders of children and teachers...we don't need the doomer's surviorist tripe, drive this conversation/ debate, we need to confront why people feel so threatened, society need's lessons in gratitude, to become kind, we must practice; in traffic, on our sidewalks, in our schools, at work, but we must be examples of the people in our world we wish for our children, to practice compassion...this season, now, while many suffer depression, use a kind word or gesture, unlimber your better side, watch how transforming small acts encourage others to repeat it, find the strength to continue past the season, by recognizing our own conduct to change, we change the world; we all take our integrity from doing the right thing, when nobody is looking.... smile, it is by increments, we perform miracles. It's all small change...

Never let a good tragedy go to waste always find a way to push your agenda.

Oh Puh-leeeeeeze Ms Burdick, get a grip.  You have a long history of anti-gun Legislation proposals. Yes the proposal was ready to go, but the timing was coincidental??????  My posterior.  Never wasting an opportune moment, you launched this proposal knowing the bleeding hearts would react to it due to the recent tragic event.  "Do 50 round clips (sic) really have a place in civilized society?"  You bet your posterior they do.  Because it's a free market society.  Not everybody who is shooting a rifle is hunting.  They game laws specify that ALL rifles are limited to a 5 round capacity.  Ms Burdick, let me clue you in on something; not all rifles are used for hunting big game.   Some use a 5, 10, 15, 20 plus round capacity magazine because we're not hunting but just plain enjoying the sport of shooting.  But more importantly, we use higher capacity magazines, ...BECAUSE WE CAN.  I suppose you go along with mayor Bloomberg asking if 64 oz Big Gulps have a place in society because they cause obesity.  God knows that alone is going to stop fat, overweight, lethargic kids.  I'm sure 64oz Big Gulps has everything to do with kids not getting off their butts and going outside for some form of physical activity.   Forget the fact that they will buy two 32oz and go back for a refill.  Kinda like a 10 round magazine.  The naive thought that limiting access to 10 rounds is going to save the world is ludicrous.  Because the bad guy is going to think:  "Ummmm, gee, I only have a 10 round magazine; well, good thing I brought ten of them with me because I can't get the 30 rounders anymore so I'll just reload more often."  The thought process of some of our elected "officials" amaze me.  You say "There's no legitimate use for these things"?  Again, I say BS.  My legitimate reason is that I'm lazy.  I don't want to have to reload as often when I'm at the range.  Or, how about if I shoot in the sport of 3-gun competition where a reload on the clock puts me in 42nd pace instead on the top 5?  Or how about the idea that I, without breaking any laws of our state or federal government, just want to own one?   You say people are in support of "reasonable" gun laws?  Reasonable?  What is reasonable?  That's just a buzzword you use to placate the ones who may not question your motives.  Reasonable in whose opinion?  Yours?  Trust me, your opinion of what is "reasonable" is not mine.  Every motion you make to restrict the lawful ownership of legally obtained firearms and their accessories is NOT reasonable.  I must however, agree with you an one statement the "assault weapons have no place in our society".  But I would ask you then, what is an assault weapon?  An "assault weapon" is a fist.  It is a knife, it is a golf club, it is a baseball bat.  It is an inanimate object used in an aggressive act upon an unwilling participant.  Assault is a behavior, not a weapon.  When you say that these "military weapons of war that have no other purpose than to kill people have no place in a civilized society", you are woefully incorrect.  A firearm is solely designed to launch a projectile through means of chemical reaction.  Nothing more.  It is not until a set of human hands that pick it up and determine how it used is when it becomes a weapon.  Until that moment, it just another inanimate piece of metal; the same as the afore mentioned golf club and baseball bat.  But if you insist that a firearm is an instrument to kill, again, I will disagree, moreover, I would tell you that having the free, unfettered possession of firearms, by law-abiding citizens have SAVED lives.  Many times, the mere presence of a law-abiding citizen with a firearm has prevented tragedy.  But you, in your crusade, would chose to prevent me from having the ability to protect myself or my loved ones in the manner in which I deem most appropriate.

 

I wonder...  For those out there who would say that the Second Amendment is out dated and passe', because after all, it was written by our Founding Fathers when the most sinister military instrument of the day was a .75 caliber Brown Bess muzzle loading musket, would they say that the current stable of AR-style platform rifles have no place under the 2nd Amendment?  Could they have ever envisioned the ability of a rifle, the idea of which was still in its infancy (yes rifle, everything else in its day was a smoothbore musket), having the ability to fire multiple rounds with just the simple pull of the trigger?  Of course not.  So therefore, say the people, that fear the inanimate, perceived evil, black, sinister looking, pistol gripped, bayonet lug accoutermented, semi-automatic rifle has no place in today's society.  Nah, they couldn't have thought of that so the 2nd should be retired, repealed, shelved.  

 

Then I would ask this;  Would the framers of our revered Constitution, after drafting the 1st Amendment, could have ever thought of the possibility of having a hand-held device that would allow you to speak with anybody, anywhere in the wold instantly?  Or to have access to information from learning how to make Grandma's apple pie to the theory of nuclear fission at their fingertips?  Somehow I doubt it because Ben Franklin just got zapped by a lightning bolt to his kite.  So with these things never being thought of, using the logic to repeal/modify/abolish the 2nd Amendment should we abolish and retire the 1st Amendment because they were not pertinent to the times?  Oh no!  The masses would cry!  What about our Right of Assembly? What about our right of free speech?  What about our right of "expression"?  

 

What then, of the Fourteenth Amendment? Where it is stated "that nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."   Did the Framers of the Constitution have abortion in mind when they wrote that?  Doubt it.  Many people and organizations hold upon high the the decision of Roe v. Wade of a woman choosing to have an abortion being clothed in the protection of the 14th Amendment, (which I find ironic in that it states that "nor shall any State deprive any person of life"). Under this Amendment, it allows the willful and intentional termination of life by scraping and suction, a living fetus from a woman's womb.  This year alone, there have been over 1,199,732 abortions alone.  Over ONE MILLION.  What's the ratio of firearm related deaths to that?  Firearms deaths pale in comparison to that number. (oh, did I offend you by my blatant statement of fact?  Please Refer to 1st Amendment)  Should we repeal the 14th Amendment because that has allowed far more cessation of life than the 2nd Amendment?  Nope, not gonna happen is it?  To be clear, that if it is your decision to have an abortion, that is your decision, and yours alone.  It's your choice.  Choose wisely.  But I digress.

 

The upshot is that there are Amendments to our Constitution.  Why should people think that one is more important than the other or that one should be repealed because it is "outdated" or "doesn't fit the times"?  They are there.  Work within them, do not take them away or infringe upon what the Founding Fathers gave us but rather look at the core of our society and correct the behavior rather than convict the tools.  

So soon, law abiding gun owners will be reduced to using single-shot muskets, while the criminals and criminally insane are continuing to use assault weapons. Yeah... this makes sense.

To claim that an inanimate object, say a gun, knife, blunt object or other handy object, is responsible for the violence we see is ludicrous.  It would be tantamount to claiming that spelling and grammatical errors are the fault of the writing instrument or the keyboard.  In our Constitution it acknowledges that the people are sovereign and not the government. It further states that all rights are theirs by birthright and to form an orderly form of Government they may confer some of those rights upon the government.  It further goes on to enumerate those rights  that are allowed to the Federal Government and which are allowed to the state government.  The people do not relinquish any of their rights as they are endowed unto them at birth and as such can rescind from the Fed or the State if they so see fit those they conveyed unto them i.e. the clause in the Declaration of Independence where in order to form a more perfect union ... .  If one was still steeped in the original writings of the time whence our government was formed (sorely not done in the schools of today) you would see rather quickly that people were never to live in fear of the government but in order to prevent tyranny and or tyrants the people have the freedom to own possess and use firearms and the government may not infringe that right in any manner.  Statistics show that violent crime drops significantly where firearm ownership is free and much higher where restricted.  If Society has become so sick and twisted then one needs to look at the root causes.  In doing so you will see that our society has lost its moral compass, personal ownership for their actions and words. Honesty and respect have blown with the wind of Liberal dogma.  We as a people need to reevaluate the illness that befalls our society and address that, not blame an inanimate object incapable of free action.  I and my family are alive thanks to our training and ownership of firearms.  I do not wish on anyone that they should face a home invasion by 4 drugged out felons bent on no good.  They live today but not unmarked yet still in prison.  Give me Liberty and the Freedoms as enumerated in our founding documents.  Hold the Head Shrinks and Politicians culpable for not protecting the people from those with malice in their minds. 

Eliminate automatic and semi automatic weapons for anyone who is not LE or military.

Require intensive gun training and test before anyone can purchase a gun

Put a stop to the violent video games and movies (as a side note)

criminals are lawless for a reason.... so how is more gun control going to slow or stop some one that does not obey the laws in the first place. all more gun control does is make it easyer for criminals and enslaves law abiding citizens.  the only good and true gun control. is some one that takes their rights and use them... buy a gun.. then learn how to use it and then get their concealed weapons permit.

Ginny, the wicked witch of Oregon.

Senator Burdick, 

Consider the history (world wide) of efforts to restrict guns and how that relates to all aspects of people's lives.  Then, just for giggles, describe the period in history as well as the place where the greatest freedoms have existed.  Next, tell us all how both the greatest freedoms and guns in the hands of ordinary citizens could have POSSIBLY happened at the same time?  Perhaps those two concepts are closely linked?

 

Before you hold forth with rhetoric and political agenda, stop and think.  Your constituents deserve no less.

 

Passing more laws that criminals disobey without thought is only going to restrict the freedoms and lives of law abiding citizens.

 

If you have a burning desire to solve this and so many other issues pressuring our society today, simply write a bill that says something to the effect of "Congress shal have no special protections not afforded the average citizen, shal be subject to the same laws and effects of the average citizen, can pass no law they themselves are not subject to.

 

When YOU work every day in an office that has NO armed guards, then perhaps your opinion will have merit.  Until you are equal on a daily basis with the rest of us - your words fall on deaf ears.

Ginny Burdick, stay out of it.  Assault weapons don't kill people.  It's the idiots that steal them or are sold them by private citizens that kill people.  The law needs to read "Any firearm sold or bought by a private party has to have a background check and the serial number registered with law enforcement agencies."

listen folks. this will not change a thing if someone wants to kill. they will kill...period... they will steal one or they will make one, we are dealing with EVIL , like all of a sudden if we make Automatic weapons illegal this will stop?, no way , I am not trying to advocate don't do anything but please understand we are dealing with very unstable people here if some one wants to take out their own Mother and innocent children, the two most beautiful words that describe LOVE, they will not stop just because the law says  "Now you can not kill anyone with a automatic weapon" that's the law when they just broke the most immoral law there is by planning to kill their Mother and innocent kids!, and you say "we must do something"  what you are doing is forcing these RATS in to a corner where they will go to extreme measures by a bomb, gas, or other means that would be unspeakable to mention on here, don't forget most of these killers are NOT stupid people they would put all there efforts into making a device that would do harm to many including themselves , which they could careless about also. 

Schools and malls, what do they have in common . There places where people are unarmed and easy targets as they are unarmed.

Sure, the average citizen doesn't "need" an assault rifle. Nor does the average citizen "need" a 50" Plasma TV, an automobile less than 10 years old, a large home, a large capacity refrigerator, an i-Phone, cable or satellite TV or any other of the hundreds of unnecessary items that we "choose" to purchase.